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Hafk
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PostSubject: The Rhythm Game thread.   Thu Jun 10, 2010 3:52 am

Rock Band 3

Link to video

-A keyboard with two full octaves! a 25 key fully functional MIDI keyboard.
-Pro mode makes use of cymbals on drums. Pro mode on guitar plays with a real guitar. Poos is crazy.
-With Guitar, Bass, Drums, Keyboard, and up to three vocal parts, RB3 supports EIGHT players.

SONGS CONFIRMED:
Metric - Combat Baby
Them Crooked Vultures - Dead End Friends
The Vines - Get Free
Phoenix - Lasso
Juanes - Me Enamora
Ida Maria - Oh My God
Rilo Kiley - Portions for Foxes
The Whites Stripes - The Hardest Button to Button
Jane's Addiction - Been Caught Stealing
Spacehog - In the Meantime
Stone Temple Pilots - Plush
Smash Mouth - Walkin' on the Sun
Ozzy Osborne - Crazy Train
Whitesnake - Here I Go Again
Joan Jett - I Love Rock and Roll
The Cure - Just Like Heaven
Dio - Rainbow in the Dark
Huey Lewis and the News - The Power of Love
Night Ranger - Sister Christian
Queen - Bohemian Rhapsody
The Doors - Break on Through
Jimi Hendrix - Crosstown Traffic

Guitar Hero: Warriors of Rock


-A brutal legend-eqse career mode.
-12 challenges for every song, on disc, DLC, imports, EVERY song.
-Character powers to alter up scoring and gameplay.

CONFIRMED ARTISTS AND SONGS
A Perfect Circle - The Outsider
AFI - Dancing Through Sunday
Anberlin - Feel Good Drag
Anthrax - Indians
Avenged Sevenfold - Bat Country
Band of Skulls - I Know What I Am
Black Sabbath - Children of the Grave
Buzzcocks - What Do I Get?
Children of Bodom - If You Want Peace, Prepare for War
The Cure - Fascination Street
Def Leppard - Pour Some Sugar on Me (Live)
Dethklok - Bloodlines
The Dillinger Escape Plan
Dire Straits - Money for Nothing
Dragonforce - Fury of the Storm
Drowning Pool - Bodies
Fall Out Boy - Dance, Dance
Flyleaf - Again
Foo Fighters - No Way Back
Foreginer - Feels Like The First Time
The Hives - Tick Tick Boom
Jane's Addiction - Been Caught Stealing
Jethro Tull - Aqualung
John 5 - Black Widow of La Porte
Kiss - Love Gun
Linkin Park - Bleed it Out
Megadeth - Holy Wars... The Punishment Due
Megadeth - Sudden Death
Megadeth - This Day We Fight!
Metallica and Ozzy Osbourne - Paranoid (Live)
Muse - Uprising
My Chemical Romance - I'm Not Ok (I Promise)
Night Ranger - (You Can Still) Rock in USA! USA! USA! USA! USA! USA! USA! USA!
Nine Inch Nails - Wish
The Offspring - Self Esteem
Queen - Bohemian Rhapsody
Rammstien - Waidmanns Heil
The Rolling Stones - Stray Cat Blues
Rush - 2112 (ALL OF IT)
Silversun Pickups - There's No Secrets This Year
Slash feat. Iggy Pop - We're All Gonna Die
Slash feat. Ian Astbury and Izzy Stradlin - Ghost
Slayer - Chemical Warfare
Slipknot - Psychosocial
Soundgarden - Black Rain
Stone Temple Pilots - Interstate Love Song
ZZ Top - Sharp Dressed Man (Live)

I will work more on this post in the future as I don't have much concentration right now, but I don't want to put off either (I know of it don't do it noiw I'll never do it). But as of right now:

RB3 looks to be the ultimate simulation experience.
GH:WoR looks to be the ultimate arcade experience.
DJ Hero 2 looks awesome, but if it has the same engine problems as the first one then I am not buying it at all.

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PostSubject: Re: The Rhythm Game thread.   Thu Jun 10, 2010 3:54 am

Oh, and I'd like to thank Neversoft for putting in all those "gimmicks" in all their Guitar Hero games that somehow ended up in Rock Band 3. Oh wait, they aren't gimmicks when Harmnox does them.

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PostSubject: Re: The Rhythm Game thread.   Thu Jun 10, 2010 2:59 pm

As for predictions.

GH:Warriors of Rock is looking to be a hardcore players dream. Plenty of intense tracks and so many different things to do involving song challenges. I love it.

Rock Band 3 looks to be the complete game changer. Pro-Drums adding cymbal notes in sounds AWESOME, I hope pro-drums also have double bass too.

Oh, and Bohemian Rhapsody... with three part harmonies and keyboard....

However, Pro-Mode guitar looks to be the point where it stops being a game and starts being a simulator. Six strings and a full array of frets... by that point, you might as well pick up a real guitar and skip the game entirely. I have no problem with them trying to merge the gap, but this is still a video game. I have a feeling that pro-mode guitar is just a prettier version of reading tabs.

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PostSubject: Re: The Rhythm Game thread.   Fri Jun 11, 2010 12:02 am

The closer they get to a REAL instrument simulator the better, in my opinion. Otherwise I just feel like I'm playing Simon or Bop-It. I can't wait for the day when there will be a full keyboard with each note matched key-for-key and a real guitar that recognizes exactly how and what you play. Right now practicing music can't compete for people's attention with video games because it seems dull and unintuitive and hard. But with the right game that actually trains you how to really play, well we might just end up with a nation full of actual shredders.
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PostSubject: Re: The Rhythm Game thread.   Fri Jun 11, 2010 12:30 am

Ya I'm definitely gonna have to pick up RB3 just for the pro mode. It's what I always wanted out of a music game. Soon there will be sensors that detect how loud and soft you play and with what articulation. And then finally learning music will be measured in points, completely quantitative.
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PostSubject: Re: The Rhythm Game thread.   Fri Jun 11, 2010 12:33 am

So excited...
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PostSubject: Re: The Rhythm Game thread.   Fri Jun 11, 2010 8:57 am

It's impossible for these games to teach you how to be a talented musician; in fact, it DISCOURAGES it. If all you're being taught is to play what note where, it's teaching you to be a robot, which is the opposite of a musician. It doesn't show you where to put tension or release, which is always the most important - and confused - thing. It doesn't show you how to play by feel.

It doesn't even make you play in tempo - the margin for rhythmic error is huge. If you play like this, you'll sound like a computer that is running a little bit low on CPU; the playback leaps forward suddenly, then recedes.

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PostSubject: Re: The Rhythm Game thread.   Fri Jun 11, 2010 9:55 am

Ya it's hardly a substitute for real practice. But for someone like me who just mostly needs to work up the dexterity and finger strength and to figure out where the notes are it's a pretty good tool
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PostSubject: Re: The Rhythm Game thread.   Fri Jun 11, 2010 12:14 pm

The best part? If you have a keyboard or an e-drum kit, you don't even have to use one of their controllers!



That's right. A midi controller. Only costs forty bucks, works with keyboards and e-drums.



Keyboards, 3 part Harmonies, Pro Drums, and Pro Guitar in action.

Wow.

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PostSubject: Re: The Rhythm Game thread.   Fri Jun 11, 2010 11:04 pm



After checking tabs, it looks like this is the solo Rainbow in the Dark.

That looks pretty freaking confusing, to be honest. Then again, you probably can't replicate a guitar solo like that without practicing it either, so it is understandable. I do hope RB3 has more options for Hyperspeed/Breakneck Speed. Spacing those notes out by including the option of raising the note chart speed needs to be priority #1.

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PostSubject: Re: The Rhythm Game thread.   Sat Jun 12, 2010 2:42 am

Hafkles wrote:


After checking tabs, it looks like this is the solo Rainbow in the Dark.

That looks pretty freaking confusing, to be honest. Then again, you probably can't replicate a guitar solo like that without practicing it either, so it is understandable. I do hope RB3 has more options for Hyperspeed/Breakneck Speed. Spacing those notes out by including the option of raising the note chart speed needs to be priority #1.

WTF?!?!

What's the point of even including the chart? If you have it learned well enough to actually be able to read it while you play, you would definitely have it memorized, and at that point, the chart fails to even be a reference. So you might as well throw it out.

That's pretty freakin confusing. I also find it kind of disheartening to find that it's pretty much all on one string - why not take advantage of 6 strings instead of flying up and down the neck? Kind of a lazy transcription.

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PostSubject: Re: The Rhythm Game thread.   Sat Jun 12, 2010 2:53 am

On another note, this full guitar is exactly what Guitar-sim games should have been like in the first place - none of this five-button PlayMates plastic toys. They keep adding one little essential thing that SHOULD have been in the first game - and easily could have - with each passing expansion.

Soon, you'll be tweaking an actual plug-in distortion pedal at your feet for your exact sound... oh God, people will go crazy for that.

Oh, and they'll charge $80 for the distortion pedal. bounce EXCITED!!!

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PostSubject: Re: The Rhythm Game thread.   Sat Jun 12, 2010 3:59 am

I find it funny how you say that rhythm games should have been like that all along, but then bash it. You seem to be forgetting the word "game." It's simplified for accessibility. If Guitar Hero 1 was like Rock Band's Pro Guitar mode... we wouldn't have ANY rhythm games today besides Singstar. I have a feeling you are just trying to spin the whole "WHY DON'T YOU PLAY REAL GUITAR!?!?!" line that we have all been hearing for five years. To be honest, I'm sick of it. I didn't make this thread to hear that fucking line one more time.

That's the big turnoff for pro-guitar for me. It's almost too much. Although, Harmonix's goal is to bridge the gap, and also offer lessons in the game. By no way will it achieve perfect realism, but its the closest it will ever get.

Although, Pro-drums and Pro-keyboards look way better. The drums have always been slightly more realistic (Moreso on the Guitar Hero side until now, I'm sorry Harmonix, but opening the high-hat does not make the cymbal change places in the kit!), and the only things that could make it better would be inclusion of cymbals and hopefully a hi-hat pedals. I like how they are doing the keyboard interface.

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PostSubject: Re: The Rhythm Game thread.   Sat Jun 12, 2010 2:12 pm

I was saying that the six-string chart was too confusing, but I was not bashing the six-string Mode. Look at the numbers - you can't even see them, they're being covered up by the notes ahead of them. They're also too small. If they could possibly find a chart that is pretty readable - perhaps one that lays horizontally would be more intuitive, since that's how real tabs read - I think most people would find it way more kickass. I like the keyboards and three-part harmonies, too.

I'm sorry, I DID forget that this was a game. However, that doesn't change that it is ridiculously overpriced and it frusterates me that people will pay over $500 for it. Then I forgot that people can spend their money however they want.

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PostSubject: Re: The Rhythm Game thread.   Sun Jun 13, 2010 2:37 am

You are right. It should probably be a second track at the top of the screen with the vocal track instead of a vertical track. The complexity of the guitar charts and the price of entry will probably make Pro-guitar and Pro-bass become a failure, which is sad because it was made with the right idea. Harmonix wants people to go beyond the game, and hopefully get something out of it. I've talked personally with many of the developers, and about a good 80% of them are musicians as well as developers.

They priced the instruments.

Rock Band 3 Squier By Fender Stratocaster Guitar Controller
Price TBA.

Fully functional, full-sized, stringed, electric guitar. Technology built into the neck and fingerboard tracks finger positions. Transmits strum data for each of the six strings. Analog and MIDI output.

I'm guessing this will probably be $300. You will be able to plug this into an amp and play. For $300 bucks though, it would be a great beginners guitar especially considering what I can do. (You could probably get a regular Squier for less, though.) It's also nice to see what one could do with the MIDI out port on the guitar.

Rock Band 3 Wireless Fender Mustang PRO-Guitar Controller. From...Madcatz....eh.

$150.

17 frets, 6 buttons per neck, 6-string strumming area allows for discrete picking of each string, Touch-sensitive string box allows players to mute or cut off notes, MIDI output.

This controller pisses me off. It's designed to be a cheap alternative to the good controller, but it's share its size with the to-scale guitar controllers already. Not only that, it has less frets, and the game " moves down" sections for the controller. What is the point of trying to be as realistic as possible if you are dumbing it down!?!?!?!? Atleast they offered MIDI output.

Rock Band 3 Wireless Keyboard Controller

$80 Stand-alone, $130 with Rock Band 3 included.

The official keyboard you can buy with the game. Also the only controller that will be offered in a game/controller bundle. Two-octave keyboard (C3 to C5) with velocity-sensitive keys (non-weighted). MIDI output. Includes touch strip for as-yet-undetermined purpose. Can be played flat, but it also has strap hooks so you can play it like a keytar...if you are into that sort of thing. Can also be used to play the lead guitar or bass (Non-Pro mode, of course)

Pro-mode keyboards offer the two octave layout, while regular Keyboard just has five buttons. They did this so people could play keyboards with their guitar and bass controllers, while people who want the full experience could opt for pro-mode keyboard. As such, Keyboard also supports the 5 button input of Guitar and Bass. I figured there would be Midi out. Glad to see the keytar option being available, even if it is kind of silly. I am shocked that they went with a touch strip over a standard pitch wheel, though. I assume the pitch wheel function will probably be on the strip, though. For $80 bucks, it looks pretty good. But what if you already have a keyboard? Well.....

Rock Band 3 MIDI PRO-Adapter

$40

This box is an adapter for MIDI equipment which you may already own. It supports Keyboards and E-Drums. Velocity sensitive adjustment for MIDI drums designed to reduce cross-talk during play.

Really glad they made this. One of the my favorite features of the GH:World Tour kit was the midi port. While I did end up kicking that kit to the curb (Faulty wiring, glue instead of solder, ugh), I shoved the guts of that MIDI port into a small box with the base controller and sold it to someone online that wanted to use his e-drums with Rock Band/Guitar Hero. But to be able to use keyboard and e-drums? Thats just icing on the cake.

Rock Band 3 Wireless PRO-Cymbals Expansion Kit

The RB2 kit already has cymbal support, and while there were cymbals for RB2, they weren't nessicarily useful. This time, however, they are used in Pro-mode, and not just for drum fills. These cymbals are at a 10 degree angle, and are much quieter and responsive than the ones offered for RB2 drum kits.

I still wish the hi-hat cymbal was in a better place. However, for what it is, it is a pretty decent way to upgrade my hardware. For the highest quality, it is better to go out for an electronic drum kit (which I could also use outside of the game), but for what it is worth these are okay.

No new microphones announced. I am really suprised they have yet to make official wireless microphones. Ive used the microphone that came with Lips in Rock Band, and that microphone has almost no latency at all. Considering the singer is the one who is up and around, you think they would be wireless by now. But no, the DRUMS have to be wireless!

All in all, fully upgrading to pro is very expensive. However, if you don't half-ass it, you actually get real instruments out of the deal. I plan to buy cymbals for my drum kit (Mostly because the cymbals will make it more fun, I miss the cymbals from my GH:World Tour kit), and probably the keyboard and game bundle. I do agree, these games have become really expensive. I miss the time when Guitar Hero 1 for the PS2 was a $70 bundle, and you could get the SG replica controller for $30 out of the bundle. Now they try to charge you $60-$70 for new guitars, $90-100 for new drums. Ugh, wallet rape. But then again, we all spend money on stupid things every now and then.

I have probably spent more money buying the games and downloadable content than the instruments. I usually buy the instruments on sale (my RB2 drums) or fix used controllers (The case for both of my Les Paul controllers). I bought brand new instruments only once, with the bundle for Guitar Hero: World Tour. The guitar and the drums both crapped out on me. Not only that, but the game was decent at best. Worst $170 i've ever spent.

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PostSubject: Re: The Rhythm Game thread.   Sun Jun 13, 2010 10:09 am

LOL can you imagine a drummer running around while he's playing? "Lookit me! I'm wireless!"

Those instruments look pretty fucking cool. It's a shame that they price it totally out of range for the very people they market it to. Yes, I would want to play this game, but I literally couldn't even pay for it. Then I'd get bored of it after a few days, so a waste anyway.

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PostSubject: Re: The Rhythm Game thread.   Sun Jun 13, 2010 11:10 am

I'm imagining some sort of harness that cause the Rock Band drums to be set up like marching band tenors.

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PostSubject: Re: The Rhythm Game thread.   Tue Jun 15, 2010 9:37 am

Drummers are famously known for their ADD. Knowing marching band tenors, I fear wireless rockband...

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PostSubject: Re: The Rhythm Game thread.   Tue Jun 15, 2010 12:26 pm

i have to agree with Rat. without something tethering them down, drummers get dangerous...especially if there are hammers around.
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PostSubject: Re: The Rhythm Game thread.   Wed Jun 16, 2010 5:30 pm

Roundabout by Yes is in RB3. We finally have Yes.

Yes!


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PostSubject: Re: The Rhythm Game thread.   Wed Jun 16, 2010 5:32 pm

O

M

G


You see what I mean now?? This game is just packing all the stuff that should have been in the first one!

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PostSubject: Re: The Rhythm Game thread.   Mon Jun 21, 2010 6:05 pm

Rock Band 3 won't update the DLC with extra features unless they have already been implementing them. Really upset about this. Guitar Hero 5 had an update patch for all of its DLC which added Vocal SP phrasing, Band Moments, and Expert+ drumming.

I can understand the difficulties of tabbing out all of the songs for Pro-Guitar and Pro-Bass, but we will never be able to play Keyboards on songs like Highway Star, Smokin', Final Countdown, Panic Attack, etc. And we can't do harmonies on that giant Queen 10 pack released last October! It's pretty damn upsetting.

Also, on the subject of Expert+ Drumming, Pro-Mode drums won't support double bass kicks. It's almost a shame. Pro-Mode drumming is supposed to be the realistic drumming experience, not just Guitar Hero's drums with two more pads and no double bass support. Where is the hi-hat, too? You aren't going to chart hi-hat notes on the blue pad, right? Come on, even GH knows better than that. (Uses a heavier velocity sensitive note to distinguish itself. Not exactly authentic, but hey, it's still on the same pad, and that is way better than switching pads.)

Hell, I thought of something cool for Pro-Mode drumming. You plug a second pedal into the drum kit's second port, This is a on-off magnetic switch pedal (so if the foot is down, it stays on as opposed to Piezoelectric switches), And in Pro-Mode drums, a yellow sustain line would be used to indicate that you need to hold down the pedal. Yellow dots would be for quick closing and opening.

And then, since you can't be using double bass pedals and the hi-hat pedal at the same time anyway, just switch the hi-hat pedal over to work as a second bass pedal when not in use as a hi-hat. Bam, way more realistic, and you can also play your double bass with both feet, not this half-time one foot bullshit.

They kinda dropped the bomb for me. I'm still gonna love RB3, but I'm not going to get as much use out of the content I already have.


Guitar Hero Warriors of Rock is looking to be pretty great this year. It's not really innovating, but it is looking to be really fun. A bunch of powers based on scoring, 13 challenges for every song on disc and for past and future DLC/Imports, a quirky career mode, and a fine engine to boot.

RB3 is looking to be the Music Simulation game.
GH:WoR is looking to be the Music Arcade game.

Very different takes on the rhythm game genre this year. Both are going to be very fun in their own ways.

And then you have DJ Hero 2. I am really excited for it too, so expect a post about it in the future.

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PostSubject: Re: The Rhythm Game thread.   Fri Jun 25, 2010 7:02 pm

2112 in GH:WoR.

Confirmed from an article regarding the blu-ray classic albums release of Moving Pictures and 2112.

Also, when Rush got their star on the Walk of Fame today, the band was signing autographs. When asked about it, Geddy Lee said that 2112 will be getting it's own venue and everything, and that there will also be a Rush song in RB3 as well (He mentioned keyboards...expect to see some 80s Rush!).

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PostSubject: Re: The Rhythm Game thread.   Sat Jul 03, 2010 5:34 pm

Updated OP with new GH6 info.

John 5 - Black Widow of La Porte
This is going to be harder than Dragonforce, and Dragonforce is already harder than diamonds.


Three Megadeth songs.

This Day We Fight!
Holy Wars... The Punishment Due
Sudden Death (Written for GH6)

GH: Warriors of Rock?

No. Lets change that name.

GH: Setlist of Win.

Rock Band is going to win new feature wars with Keyboard and Pro Modes, but for raw gameplay.... I'm starting to think GH6 has it beat. These songs are going to be so much fun.

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PostSubject: Re: The Rhythm Game thread.   Sun Jul 04, 2010 12:45 am

If they want something "Hard, with Merit" they should have spastic ink.

The definition of "Hard, with Merit" is that the impossibility a given guitar run can be merited by the support of theory; each note having importance in the hierarchy of tonality.

This is not what happens in DragonForce guitar solos - a chunk of the notes are random filler.

Plus, Dragonforce can't even play what they write. Ron Jarzombek, on the other hand, not only effortlessly plays whatever impossible lines he can come up with, but he writes comprehensive solos that are intellectually organized and "make sense."

I am not motivated to learn random filler notes for the sake of a so-called "Epic guitar solo." People place some kind of honor in a guitar solo just because it's fast and technical. A truly epic guitar solo is fast, technical, and comprehensive.

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